We Are Not Going Anywhere

Over at the National Catholic Register, I speak to my fellow concerned Catholic. These are my thoughts about we should proceed during these times of uncertainty.

The main thing is, Stay Catholic.

I would appreciate it if you gave me a read and your thoughts. Thanks.
*subhead*We must suffer..*subhead*

Comments

  1. You're arguing this the wrong way. Don't get pulled into using the terms and framing that they set. It's not an issue that the group are "kooks." The laws in NC do *not* ban clerg (or any individuals) from officiating at a "gay marriage." No authority in NC is going to stop Jim and Phil from heading down to the local unitarian hall to have their special day.It's just that the state of NC will not recognize that union as a legal marriage. That's all.

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  2. "SSPX were right in so many of the things they said and their retention of Catholic tradition was praiseworthy. But once they separated themselves"

    That's what the modernists WANT you to think..."Jus pleeze don' throw me in no..." Piux X Patch!

    "The situation of the members of this
    Society [SSPX] is an internal matter of the Catholic Church.
    The Society is not another Church or Ecclesial Community in the
    meaning used in the Directory. Of course, the Mass and Sacraments administered by the priests of the Society are valid. "

    -- Letter from the Pontifical Council for Christian Unity

    Cardinal Edward Cassidy, President (3 May,1994)

    “This fact was confirmed again
    just last year, when the Diocese of Richmond was forced to
    retract its own previous statement that the SSPX was in schism.”

    Chris Jackson
    | Remnant Columnist Feb. 2014"

    Stop being afraid to fight for the Whole Truth!! It is our Inheritance.

    SACERDOS

    (“They have abandoned the Fort, those

    who should have defended it.” (St. John Fisher)

    Who held the Fort

    Till the Calvary came

    Fighting for all

    In His Holy Name?

    Who fed the sheep

    As the pastures burned dry

    A few Good Shepherds

    Heeding their cry?

    Who led the charge

    ‘Gainst heresy’s Huns

    Defending the degreed

    To His lowliest ones?

    Who battened down

    The hatch of the barque

    To warm cold souls

    From shivering-seas dark?

    “Who?” mocks Satan

    Delighting in doubt

    Fills you with questions,

    Never lets you find out.

    “Hoc est enum

    Corpus meum…

    and for many…” who kept

    The dead words – Te Deum!

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  3. I'm not sure if my earlier comment was moderated out or disappeared thanks to internet gremlins, but here goes. If it's a repeat, I apologize. "Stay Catholic" is good advice, but how does one do that if, as many rightfully fear, the end result of the upcoming October Synod is nothing short of apostacy? Does one remain with the apostates, listening to their teachings, discounting the bad ones and accepting the good ones (a stopped clock being right twice a day, etc)? Can you count on being able to tell the difference, particularly when the stakes are the eternal destiny of your soul? Yes, staying on the barque of Peter is always to be desired, but when many of the officers seem intent on throwing as many passengers overboard if not scuttling the ship, a lifeboat like the SSPX, is a perfectly reasonable, non-protestant choice. Particularly when they recognize their place as a lifeboat and not the ship itself, as they do.

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  4. The most ironic thing about those who continue to mock and speak ill of anyone who has concerns with the communication style of the Pope is how they routinely proclaim that they “get Francis” and how much “they love that guy.” It’s quite clear that they don’t “get Francis” at all. Because of they did, their style would change dramatically.

    But there is also something else to consider when considering this crowd.Their negative reaction is also a demonstration of some concern and in some cases it is perhaps indicative of their own insecurities regarding the style of the Pope and wanting to shut down any possible criticism of him as a means of denial.

    Indeed, stay Catholic. The Church is bigger than any one person and quite honestly, the Pope is a “faithful son of the Church.” His tactics might cause some concern but he is…Catholic.

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  5. "Gates of Hell shall not prevail."


    Stay within the Church and focus on your soul and that of your family. God will sort the higher level stuff out. We can help with prayer and fasting.

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  6. So are the SSPX in communion or not?
    I hear both yes and no.

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  7. I think they are in a "limbo" if you will.


    It's like a boat that came undone at the pier and is drifting out to see. It is not longer tied up and secure, yet we can still see it float out there near us all but ever so slightly moving away.

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  8. Stu took my "gates of hell" comment.

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  9. Ain't. Going. Anywhere.
    Never.
    I am watching and praying, too. Asking the same questions. Oh, yeah.
    Take this to be a call from Heaven to get holier. And holier.
    And then, holier.
    And honestly, I'll be keeping an eye on the skies - for angels with flaming swords to come flyin' outa the clouds.
    I'm not kidding.

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  10. Of course the gates of hell will not prevail. I know this. That doesn't mean untold numbers won't be lost en route. Focusing on my own soul is exactly what I'm talking about. In the guidance of my soul I would trust bishop Fellay long before Cardinal Kasper.And we can also fast and pray while receiving guidance from the SSPX. Not an either-or situation.

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  11. You bet times are a changing!
    We are at the point of a spear!
    More than any time in history, wholesale persecution of Christains, domestic and abroad, are at an all time high. It amounts to culturally sanctioned murder!
    I don't know what marching orders from heaven were given to others, but mine were "not" to be intimidated! Not to sit down, roll over, shut up or cower in a corner when confronted with evil! There will be a time, very soon, when free speech will no longer be tolerated. It is here, now. As with any action, there are consequences and repercussions. I have asked myself, am I ready to die for Christ at a moments notice? We all have been singularly called to faith and to participate in a mission.
    And of course, you when you have been effective in enemy territory (spiritual warfare), when you will experience uncomfortable "blowback"!
    Thank You, Sacred and Immaculate Hearts, for the courage to live each day for you!

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  12. I would choose neither of those two at this point and fortunately they aren't the only choices that God gives us.

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  13. Stu said:

    "Gates of Hell shall not prevail."

    ...but the "GAYS" of Hell sure are! Yes, pray & fast BUT DO SOMETHING! Start supporting the true Catholic Priests training our sons & daughters in the One, Holy Catholic Faith!! Stop listening to those old heretics telling you "Oh, those guys aren't in "full" communion" God's sake, you men!!!

    AN
    UNCOMMON
    PLACE

    This is a fearful place
    This is an awesome place
    A Christian ground
    To bear our race.

    Tabernacle
    House of Gold
    Hidden Jesus
    Boys behold.

    Outside Chapel
    Men enrage
    Cloistered minds
    In truth engage.

    This is a fearful place
    This is an awesome place
    A Christian fort
    The enemy, face.

    Before a game
    Before a class
    Rosary said
    On beads of brass.

    Before Confession
    They examine
    Gorge on grace
    Gainst sin-fed famine.

    This is a fearful place
    This is an awesome place
    A tower of ivory
    Their garrison, base.

    And upon the pitch
    “Push back the age
    As hard as it pushes against you”
    Rage!

    This Christian ground
    This fort, this tower
    Fearful, awesome…
    It’s now your hour!!

    See now, the future...

    http://tinyurl.com/l93r35u

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  14. I fear that after October, those essentially will be the only choices. You can "stay catholic" with the those having the outward appearance of Christ's Church, or you can "stay Catholic" with those technically on the outside looking in, but holding to the faith of the saints and martyrs. If it comes to that, how will you choose?

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  15. I deny that such will be the choice.


    Stay within the Church and be obedient to the leadership. If they do something wrong in teaching, that is on their hands, not yours. Remain faithful to the teachings and focus on your own soul as that in turn will enable you to help others spiritually as well. But you don't go off on your own or join a bunch who are waling away from Saint Peter (even if very slowly).

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  16. We disagree on the likelihood of such a choice. I believe the writing is on the wall. "If they do something wrong in teaching, that is on their hands, not yours." I disagree entirely. It may also be on their hands as well, but we will not escape responsibility for those wrongs we do, despite knowing they are wrong. "I was just following orders" is never a good a excuse for sin.

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  17. LS,


    I do support TRUE Catholic Priests. Here's the thing. I can't control what the leadership does. Sure, I can't make my voice known and I do. But ultimately, that's there charge in life and they will be held accountable accordingly for both the good and bad. I'll stay on the Barque of Saint Peter and in my obedience to that, God will take care of me. Of that, I have faith.


    As traditionalists, we always seem to like to talk of people like Padre Pio or other Saints who suffered persecution at the hands of the Church. I wish all traditionalists would reflect upon what that really means. That last thing we need is more Catholics going their own way.

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  18. So you think the Church is about to teach moral error? Really?


    Didn't we start this with the "Gates of Hell shall not prevail"? What does that mean to you?


    And nobody has suggested "I was just following orders" as any kind of excuse.


    Buck up man. Have some faith. Now isn't the time to scatter into the woods at the first signs of apparent trouble.

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  19. Yes, I'm familiar with the notion of the SSPX being the savior of the Catholic Church.


    I'm banking on Jesus Christ instead.


    While I am sympathetic and share MANY of their concerns, the whole "go it alone" approach is reminiscent of other "reformers."


    I didn't get on the Barque of Saint Peter to simply case myself adrift at the first sign of trouble.

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  20. It's not going away. The documentary airs Monday night. My take:

    http://subcreators.com/blog/2014/05/03/distortions-are-abundant-in-the-jesus-wife-documentary/

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  21. ANOTHER

    NEW

    FORT

    Such names they call us

    That's not what we are

    We are Roman Catholics

    At the front of the war.

    Some just go AWOL

    Others defect

    Copying our stance

    Then say we’re a sect.

    A lot like in England

    Saint John Fisher's day

    When his brothers said, "yes"

    This Saint replied, "nay".

    All alone in the Fort

    St. John Fisher stood

    Preserving, defending

    For the whole all that's good.

    Not just for himself

    Those attached to what's old

    Or reformers, reforming

    Pretending they're bold.

    We're simply preserving,

    Once again the True Fort

    While those with new orders

    Relinquish support.

    And with promises made

    To men hungry for power

    They mock, stand and point

    At us in the tower

    Hoping for all

    Ecumenical democracy

    When in fact their new fort

    Is a catastrophic kleptocracy.

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  22. No, I don't believe that the Church is about to teach moral eror. I believe that a group of individuals who happen to have high stations in the Church (bishops and cardinals, at least), are about to see to it that Holy Mother Church's teachings remain the same (technically) but are entirely divorced from the manner in which the faithful actually "live the gospel" through a false sense of "mercy". The exact manner in which this will be done is impossible to see now. But as I said, the writing is on the wall. And I'm not the only one who sees this.

    As for "the gates of hell will not prevail" means that the ultimate victory is already Christ's. That does not assure anyone of their own individual salvation. Or that of their family. Many can and will be lost. For all eternity.

    Perhaps the "just following orders" part was not exactly on point and too "loaded" to make the point well. Let's try this example. Let's say you have a baseball that was autographed by Babe Ruth. You tell your sons to leave it in the case. Don't touch it. Despite this, your younger son (just for grins, let's call him "Stu") takes it and plays ball with his friends with it. When you discover this, his excuse is that that your older son (just for grins, let's call him Peter) was left in charge and he said it was OK. Keep in mind however, that both know full well what you have instructed. Yes, the older son now has a lot of explaining to do, but will that excuse absolve the younger son? Now tell me how, "But Peter said I could" will absolve any of us from disobeying Christ's exact words concerning something far more important than a baseball? And if Stu knew what Peter said was wrong in this one thing, should he take it for granted that Peter was giving good advice on other matters? Or should maybe he at least consider what your middle son (just for grins, let's call him "Marcel") says, seeing as how Marcel had the nerve to contradict Peter on the baseball?

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  23. Very thoughtful post. And that first paragraph sooo echoed Our Lady's warnings at Akita, Japan.

    Our Lady also said that the Enemy's assault against consecrated souls would be "especially implacable."

    Time to suit ourselves with the armor of G-d so that we may withstand "the day of evil." Boy, if there ever was a time...

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  24. Doesn't matter if the Episcopals are inconsistent or hypocritical , if NC law restricts the services a clergyman can perform then it's over the line. If however the law simply says do what you will but the state will not recognize that "marriage" then they are within bounds.

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  25. Talking in prose, can be cute;

    I suppose.

    But real dialogue, takes a lot more;

    But for some, it’s clearly too much a chore.

    …or alternatively…

    Hickory Dickory Dock…

    Just try saying what you mean and actually engage in
    discourse because the constant desire to make poems gives the impression that
    you lack substance and instead want to distract people with style.

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  26. " I believe that a group of individuals who happen to have high stations in the Church (bishops and cardinals, at least), are about to see to it that Holy Mother Church's teachings remain the same (technically) but are entirely divorced from the
    manner in which the faithful actually "live the gospel" through a false sense of "mercy".



    And that is a BELIEF.
    I prefer to deal in what is actually happening. Now I won’t deny that there are voice within the Church with motivation that you speak about. But there have always been destructive voice within the Church and Holy Mother Church, guided by the Holy Spirit will sort it out. That’s part of the “gate of Hell shall not prevail”. And FTR, I didn’t assert that it had anything to do with the salvation of individuals. But I can tell you this, you better to be on the Barque of Saint Peter as a faith
    deckhand for God than attempting cast off on your own. God will guide that Barque contrary to the
    steering orders of the crew.

    Your analogy assumes that Peter is going to instruct us to do something that is immoral. First, that hasn’t happened. Second, I don’t believe it is possible for that to happen. Do you? Do you think the Pope can teach moral error? And as to the culpability to those who follow lawful teachers into error? That’s for God to sort out. But let’s keep in mind that even with his condemnation of the Pharisees, Christ told his follower to do as they say because they were lawfully put into the Chair of Moses.

    And Archbishop Lefebvre, God Bless him for he had many GREAT attributes, was given a lawful order from the Pope not consecrate additional Bishops. He was flat out disobedient to this
    order. Not the example we have from Saints of happy memory who face persecution from the Church with obedience.

    Have faith in God. He is in control.

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  27. Sorry, that's just the kind of (Catholic) hairpin I am!

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  28. Well, at least we have established that you can talk without rhyming or use of iambic pentameter or haiku or whatever.

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  29. "With Christians, a poetical view of things is a duty,
    --we are bid to color all thing with hues of faith, to see a divine meaning in
    every event, and a superhuman tendency." (Cardinal Newman: Essays
    Critical and Historical, 19th cent.)

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  30. So you talk in prose because Cardinal Newman demands it?


    Really?

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  31. Not because he "demands" but, because if you can, do! There are many ways to express the True Faith & some do with "hue" ;-)

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  32. I appreciate that answer. And, at times, I have enjoyed your words.


    But at some point in having a discussion, it would be good to have, well, a discussion.

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  33. Fishwrap has a hit piece where Michael Sean Winters calls Pat a "dissenting cafeteria Catholic".
    We are truly in bizzaro word these days

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  34. "As traditionalists, we always seem to like to talk of people like Padre Pio or other Saints who suffered persecution at the hands of the Church. I wish all traditionalists would reflect upon what that really means. That last thing we need is more Catholics going their own way."

    Excellently put! St. Padre Pio, of all people, was willing to die rather than disobey his superiors, even when they were mistaken (excepting a hypothetical clear command to sin). As St. Maximilian Kolbe said, "Our superiors may err; but we never err in obeying."

    Before anyone objects: yes, I know (full well) that we're not to throw our brains out the window; I also know that there are some times when we must refuse obedience out of a higher obedience. But the latter case seems to be used far more often as a pretext for "doing what I please", rather than a true "I would sin if I were to obey, and I cannot do that." If, hypothetically, some pseudo-ecclesiatical group (such as the USCCB, which is a mere bureaucracy of laity, in tandem with the actual bishops) were to establish "guidelines" by which the divorced and "remarried" (civilly) people might approach (sacrilegiously) the Eucharist, then we would need to denounce that decision with full voice... but NOT break unity with St. Peter. Never, never. The SSPX, despite their excellent qualities, did just that (by illicitly ordaining bishops), and for that, there is no excuse. No... keep to orthodoxy, to be sure (even in the face of heterodox clergy--which, thank God, seem to be rarer and rarer, even though they are currently and often in positions of great influence, politically and strategically)... but do not use that as an excuse to accept rebellion against St. Peter, in any shape or form.

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  35. Stu, it is a belief based on current events, such as Pope Francis essentially giving Card. Kasper an endorsement of his views on divorce, remarriage and communion at the recent Synod, among other things. Do I believe that it is possible for the Pope to teach error? I'll put it this way, I think it is possible for the Pope to teach in a way that causes extreme confusion. The "Who am I to judge" episode is a case in point. Of course, the words of HH have been warped beyond the breaking point, and yet, even in the face of that, no correction has come from Rome. As for Archbishop Lefebvre, we have him to thank for Summorum Pontificum. Without his "disobedience" we would still be laboring under the 40 year long lie that the Vetus Ordo had been abrogated or even could be abrogated. That was another papal teaching that perhaps wasn't error per se (or perhaps was), but was definitely the cause of confusion.

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  36. You have God to thank for SP. If we truly believe that the "freeing" of the Old Mass is both essential and pleasing to God, then He willed it and He could certainly have done the same with an obedient Archibishop Lefebvre. Don't you agree?


    And ultimately the Church "righted" itself like any seaworthy barque will do in rough seas. Have Faith.

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  37. Ultimately, yes of course we have God to thank for Summorum. And yes, I believe He wished for the Vetus Ordo to be restored and it would have eventually happened even without the good Archbishop. In God's good time. Who knows when that might have been? In my experience, God generally doesn't seem to revoke our free will, even in important matters. Our cooperation with His will is still necessary. As I've said from the beginning, I have no doubt of the ultimate destination of the barque of Peter. That isn't in question. At all. What is in question is how many will be on board when it gets there. And the passenger list won't be enlarged with things like this: http://rorate-caeli.blogspot.com/2014/05/cardinal-kasper-in-nyc-ghost-of-vatican.html

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  38. Okay. So do you think that it was God's will that Archbishop Lefebvre was disobedient to a direct and lawful order from the Pope? We aren't talking about the Pope ordering him to something immoral. We are talking about the Pope ordering him not to do something that falls well within the purview of the Pope to command.


    I don't believe that is how God operates. Instead, I think he rewards the obedience of his especially when the obedience brings hardship.


    Indeed, Cardinal Kasper is, to put it very mildly, kooky and spouting some things that have the possibility (or have already) put people in spiritual harm. But we have had that all throughout history and always will. So, I'm not saying we don't speak up about it but rather we do it within the Church, obey lawful orders from those that God put above us, focus on our holiness to provide an example for others and pray that the Holy Spirit will light our way. That, to me, is the traditional way of approaching these things.

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